Ask Dan & Jennifer

i don't think there's any such thing as unconditional love... not caring about who a person is or what they do IS indifference.

There is always a reason why you love someone. Whether it's I love you because you're beautiful, or I love you because you make me feel happy or anything else, there's always a reason. The closest relationship i can think of to unconditional love is that of a parent for a son or daughter. However, if you think a little harder, this love is NOT unconditional. Your children are your legacy, so you want the best for them. In a way, they are an investment in the future. If your child turns out to be a murderer or a rapist, will you REALLY love them as much as you love a child who turned out a doctor, a teacher, a productive member of society? I do not think any good parent will not CARE about who or what their child is. Perhaps they will love their child no matter what, but will they love him or her as much? Is this love truly unconditional?

Unconditional love is a pretty thought, but ultimately, not realistic. We don't love for no reason, and there is no guarentee to a love eternal. That's part of what makes love special.

Unconditional Love does not mean that you don't care. It's not indifference. It just means that you accept that person for who they are regardless of their actions.

You may disapprove of an action that they take, but that disapproval is of the action, not the person. It's when we tie our disapproval of the actions to the person that love becomes conditional.

I do believe in unconditional love - and you're right. It's our children who teach us that. I know for a fact that there is NOTHING that my children can do to make me stop loving them or stop showing my love for them. NOTHING. I will always be there for them regardless of the circumstance.

I'm working very hard on creating this type of relationship with everyone in my life - I say working because I have not perfected it but I know it's possible because I have it for my children.

Well, love is not always unconditional, in fact, I think it is truly rare. The biggest hurdle I can see to this is the human ego. People don't want to admit they are capabe of making a mistake or that they aren't right, so they find the bad things in their loved one and focus on that. To quote the Bible, Matthew 7:3-5 (NIV)
"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?" (regardless of what you believe about the Bible, we can agree it was written a long time ago, and a lot of human nature which has not changed in a long time can be seen there) So human nature tends to not allow us to love unconditionally. Yet, I do believe it exists. Perhaps thinking of loving them no matter what isn't the best way to look at it, but loving someone despite what they have done is a more acceptable way to see it. Yet, I have worked in the prison system, and I have seen mothers commit felonies for their sons because they wanted to make their baby boy's life behind bars a little easier... call it what you will, but isn't this unconditional love? And the wives and girlfriends who stay true to their man, even while incarcerated, and faithfully bring their children in to visit.. isn't this unconditional love? It might not be every inmate... plenty got "Dear John" letters, but those who had a good relationship to begin with, it can withstand even the most difficult of situations.

And, if you still don't believe unconditional love exists... well, no matter what I've done in my life, or what kind of person I am, my puppies love me just the same. I could have murdered 100 people, or saved a baby from a burning building, and my dogs don't care... perhaps people need to learn from the animal world...

Much in our lives is illusion... hence the title of the book that this quote came from.

We all have our own "perceptual filter" which allows us to accept some things and ignore or deny others. This perceptual filter is the culmination of our beliefs and expectations which is formed by the totality of our life experiences. Since we all have different life experiences, we all have different beliefs and expectations which we tend to project out onto our experiences in the world. And because we believe something, that does not make it "true" in the literal sense. It is merely our perception and nothing more. Truth is truth in spite of our beliefs.

Some believe that love is a feeling of connectedness that we often experience in the earlier stages of a significant relationship. Perhaps that includes a longing and an ache when we are not with the other. It can even include an excitement and a sense of pure joy as components of this feeling when we are with them. While many are prone to the belief that this is surely true love, it is not. It is simply a chemical reaction which goes away after a time, perhaps several years. It is during the time of decline of this chemical release that many become convinced that they are no longer "in love" with their significant other. They no longer "feel" that connection the same way that they did in the beginning and they convince themselves that they are "falling out of love." This is the point in many relationships when couples choose to separate or even divorce.

Actually, it is not until couples have past the point of "chemical attraction" in their relationship that they have reached a space when they can truly begin to love the other for the first time. They have passed the "blind love" stage and can now commence seeing their partner clearly for the first time. You can't truly accept another if you are incapable of seeing them clearly. There is no way around this. It is a natural human process.

Love IS unconditional acceptance.

First, to be able to love another, you must first be able to love yourself... unconditionally. With all your faults. With all your weaknesses. With all your strengths. With all your skills. With all your bad and good habits. With all your idiosyncrasies. With all of your secrets. If you are incapable of accepting yourself, then how can you possibly accept another?

Second, if you can love yourself, then it is possible to love another.

A little clarity here is in order. When I say that the act of loving another is unconditional acceptance, that does not include blindly accepting all behaviors from another... we are not our behaviors... but it does include include allowing them to be themselves and to make their own choices and to learn at their own pace on their journey in life. So you can love the person but you can also choose to not accept their actions. If your significant other is being abusive or in some way self-destructive, you may choose to offer help. If they refuse help from you or others and especially if their behaviors are a threat or danger to you or your family, it is always appropriate to protect yourself. But you can still love them in their process. Even if you choose to leave the relationship because they are making your life crazy, you can choose to hate the sin and not the sinner.

If your significant other has many more faults than virtues, it may be hard to accept them unconditionally. If their virtues far outweigh their faults, then you may find it fairly easy to accept them unconditionally. If you are having a hard time understanding any of this, then you may find reading the book, A New Earth by Eckhart Tolle of value.

Life is a journey of discovery and we're all on that journey. Please feel free to comment. We are all constantly learning from one another... and that includes me too!

Thank you for taking the time to read my comments.

unconditional love:

those two words describe it peferectly.
a parent love's their child regardless of their faults.
a lover love's their lover regardless of their faults.
a child love's their parents regardless of their faults.

once a person comes to love another, that love will never waiver. the only thing that destroys the relationship between those is the act of breaking trust. the love will remain, but the trust will be lost.
without the love, the trust issue would never be a considering fact in the relationship.
every person has the ablity to forgive, but not every human can do so.

when you learn to love yourself and to forgive yourself, you will see everyone else as a person.

we are constantly learning, so we should all consider that love is a constant factor that can be used as a tool to grow.

simply, one must learn that love is unconditional, even when trust is broken. nothing is perfectly made, not even our love.

Yes I simplly love reading all these comments! So many beautiful thoughts you shared on here....my soul is bathing in joy! :)
I personally also belive that the highest form of love is acceptance, and that when I love with complete acceptance then, that love is unconditional. In times when I had chance to expereince both loving without conditions and/or being loved without conditions, it felt so good...it felt as being home. This is how I know that this is the most natural state of being for a human. It is like: once you taste it you always long to return to it, and not because it is pleasurable, but because it is so much more real and peaceful than the conditional love (to which we have been exposed most of our lives).
It is really amaising to observe people starting to literary bloom when they are surrounder by unconditional love.
Anyway, for me it is kind of life aim to learn to love in that way all the time. At the moment I am on my path of learning, and even learning it had brought lots of beauty and light into my life.
Thank you for starting this thread and thank you for all the heart nurturing comments.
Hugs
Barbara

Indifference=not caring about any aspect of the other person
unconditional love=not caring about any aspect of the other person-love no matter what.
On the surface, yes they do look the same, but think deeper...
Indifference is worse than hatred-you don't care one way or the other. Unconditional love is not worse than hatred.
Unconditional love: Shakespeare's Sonnet 130 (the one that ends 'and yet I think my love as rare/as any she belied with false compare)-would anyone say this is indifference?
They are not the same, but on the surface are.
in conclusion: Unconditional love=indifference to unredeeming features.

I don't think I could ever love someone unconditionally. Love takes effort by both people. Take attraction for example. My best friend lost interest in his lover after many years because she got really overweight and wouldn't loose it. You could argue that my friend is in the wrong but he didn't fall in love with a large girl or ever find them attractive. Thats how he is, always has been. She knew this.

Unconditional love... thats one for the story books IMO. :rolleyes:

D & J:
Unconditional Love does not mean that you don't care. It's not indifference. It just means that you accept that person for who they are regardless of their actions.

You must've misread the original quote then, or simply misinterpreted it. That's absolutely NOT what it's insinuating.

Love IS conditional. Everything is influenced by chance - fate - circumstances. Everything you DO, is also influenced by fate. Everything you manipulate was already in place for you to do so - should you miss one opportunity or pass it up, another is going to follow. Circles and cycles and systems. That's life (and probably death too)... Anyway...

Choosing who you were with - the time you met, to the kids you made - all because things worked out just so. You also fell in love with whom you CHOSE because of qualities that attracted you to them, and them to you. *You also love those kids because of whom you co-created them with! Those qualities you adorn are traits that were inheritted. Children are born of blank mind; with that said, you know you (as the doting parent) will mostly influence them and instill your idealologies within. Things you find beautiful and wonderous. Is that choice or fate for them? Confusing, I know.

For me, physical attraction is at least 70% of the equation - the other 30% is all things in common. If you can't physically love somebody, you don't accept them entirely, and thus can't love them fully. Makes sense, right? And the other "mental" percent is trivial - ideals, oppinions and standards - minds can be changed. You can "deal" or "negotiate" with each other to get what you BOTH should want. If somebody's unwilling entirely, well forget about working anything out.

I'm sure I could have put it better, but I'm in a hurry on this one.

I guess this forum is on many topics. Sorry I went off the path or misunderstood.

"Love IS conditional. Everything is influenced by chance - fate - circumstances. Everything you DO, is also influenced by fate. Everything you manipulate was already in place for you to do so - should you miss one opportunity or pass it up, another is going to follow. Circles and cycles and systems. That's life"

I read this as "stuff happens, you can't stop stuff from happening". Maybe thats the funny side of me. In any case, I agree.

As for influencing your children, true, if you're a good parent. However I find most kids are influenced by outside sources the most (90% ?). School, friends and people they run into on a day to day basis. Parents arnt around as much as you think.

For me, physical attraction is at least 70% of the equation - the other 30% is all things in common.

A friend said to me once "only ugly people say 'attraction isnt important'. I don't 100% agree but he wasn't 100% serious either. Unfortunately I see too many couples get fat and lazy after so many years and they break up. They let themselves go thinking "they love me no matter what". I always tried to make myself look better, not worse.

Its also important to have good communication, values, trust and similar interests.

Hmm, think I went off the path again.

Originally posted by: Dan And Jennifer

"To love someone unconditionallly is not to care who they are or what they do.

Unconditional love, on the surface, looks the same as indifference."

In bold is the part of the statement that seems to be going misinterpreted or ignored entirely. This is not saying unconditional love is indifference. The way someone can screw up horribly and yet you still manage to have, know and express your love for them is what's unconditional. Perhaps you could think of a time where someone like a child or lover of someone you know made a bad decision, and then, despite what may be a wincing pain, when the dust settles, both people are still there for each other. They might have even taken it so easily that it looks like the person standing by the one who screwed up is being indifferent.

This is what I think the quote is referring to.

Good stuff,
I whole heartedly believe there is such a thing as unconditional love. But I think that it often starts out conditonal. Until we no longer posess the fear of loving in that way.
I think it is conditional because we protect ourselves from being hurt. I think it becomes unconditional when you already realize that when that time comes, you will love them regardless of that hurt.

I think that respect and conditional are not the same, but can share similarities. I think that love in itself is respect.

I kinda see it as unconditional being: regardless
and conditional as: stipulated

I think the manner in which people choose to love is that love which they choose for themselves and that one is not neccesarily better than the other.

I almost had an annerism,

I hope all people are happy in their love.....love is never less

V/r ..Love

Originally posted by: Dan And Jennifer
Unconditional Love does not mean that you don't care. It's not indifference. It just means that you accept that person for who they are regardless of their actions.

You may disapprove of an action that they take, but that disapproval is of the action, not the person. It's when we tie our disapproval of the actions to the person that love becomes conditional.

I do believe in unconditional love - and you're right. It's our children who teach us that. I know for a fact that there is NOTHING that my children can do to make me stop loving them or stop showing my love for them. NOTHING. I will always be there for them regardless of the circumstance.

I'm working very hard on creating this type of relationship with everyone in my life - I say working because I have not perfected it but I know it's possible because I have it for my children.

There is another relationship that can teach you that kind of love. And that is sibling relationships. However, it may not be as easy with siblings as opposed to your child.

i disagree with you! love for a son or daughter IS unconditional.
of course you wouldnt be proud of what ur son or daughter would be doing if they were criminals,murderers, rapists etc. but theyre still your children and just because they fall in the wrong path shouldnt change the way you love them. They grow within us for 9 months we feel them move and grow in our womb (women) and if u love ur child any less because they made bad choices then ur not a very good parent, a parent needs to show love and UNCONDITIONAL LOVE and if u dont do that then thats maybe why they fall in the wrong path and make mistakes. I have a son, and of xourse i would love for him to become something useful in society one day when he moves out, but one day when he needs me im not gonna turn my back on him no matter how rough the situation... that UNCONDITIONAL LOVE and my point of view in what you said is either you have no kids..or your just a bad parent..end of story :)

Originally posted by: Kat in NJ
i don't think there's any such thing as unconditional love... not caring about who a person is or what they do IS indifference.

There is always a reason why you love someone. Whether it's I love you because you're beautiful, or I love you because you make me feel happy or anything else, there's always a reason. The closest relationship i can think of to unconditional love is that of a parent for a son or daughter. However, if you think a little harder, this love is NOT unconditional. Your children are your legacy, so you want the best for them. In a way, they are an investment in the future. If your child turns out to be a murderer or a rapist, will you REALLY love them as much as you love a child who turned out a doctor, a teacher, a productive member of society? I do not think any good parent will not CARE about who or what their child is. Perhaps they will love their child no matter what, but will they love him or her as much? Is this love truly unconditional?

Unconditional love is a pretty thought, but ultimately, not realistic. We don't love for no reason, and there is no guarentee to a love eternal. That's part of what makes love special.